Hosts Set The Week’s Stakes

SPEAKER_04 0:10

There are three of us here today on This Week in Cannabis Live. I am Jay Rosenthal. That is that is Anna Ray Grabstein and Mark Hauser. I don't even know which way I'm pointing. Um Anna Ray is, of course, from High Spirits. Mark, you are the cannabis musings guy. Um, it's been a week, man. It's July 10th. Usually things die down in July. But as we talked about before, there is uh, I don't know, some sort of hearing going on in uh northern Virginia. Um everybody's talked about it, heard about it. Uh Mark, I feel like you gave us a sense of what it was gonna be like, and it seems to be following that path. Any surprises from you about how it's going?

SPEAKER_03 0:52

Yeah, well, I'm not there, so I mean, you know, I I don't I don't know, but uh but you know, I mean, based on the um what I've read, I mean, not terribly, and you know, I mean you it was uh Kurt of Seawall for bringing on Natalie Fertig, who from uh is she still with political? She's ex-politico, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:11

I guess ex-politico, it sounds funny. Um but you know everybody else now is ex-politico. Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:15

Earth file cannabis policy federal cannabis policy reporter, uh, who you know who is uh has always done a great job with it. And um and it's uh you know, I mean she did a great job of sort of summarizing what we all expected and what we've all been hearing. Um, but you know, but was it was good to have her have that sort of uh that that seasoned you know political reporters sort of eye on it rather than you know it rather than others. And you also had uh I'm blanking on his name and he's gonna kill me for two. Gary Kaminsky, thank you. Sorry, um, on you know, one of the lawyers uh representing one of the um one of the witnesses, you know, it was great to get his perspective on it too. And um, you know, I I posted just about an hour ago, I sent out a newsletter, and just you know, making the point again that remember that you know, when we read all these breathless takes of smart admits that, you know, that the that their their witness is wrong or something like that, you know, it I mean it's interesting and it matters, but this is all setting up for the litigation. Um, you know, and who knows, you know, who knows how the judge is gonna what the judge is gonna put in the report at the end of the day? Who knows, you know, it's hard to sort of guess as to why the DEA isn't doing that much cross-examination.

Arlington Hearing Expectations And Surprises

SPEAKER_03 2:40

And you know, it's it's tough to navigate.

AnnaRae Grabstein 2:45

Yeah, Anna Ray, thoughts? Yeah, well, so one thing that I've been trying to grapple with is I've been listening to all of the takes that I possibly can. And I am totally that person that is listening to every bit of content of anyone that's going there that uh that has given it to me. It's like candy. Uh is that I'm I'm confused about what happened with the executive order and medical going to schedule three and seemingly skipping this process, and then this process continuing to exist and all the litigation that people are anticipating. And so what I what I want to do is ask you, Mark, to explain it to me if you can. And that did did the executive order make it so that medical could bypass this process? And if the executive order had been more broad, instead of identifying specifically medical, would we not have to be doing this? I just don't understand how what why why one is okay and the other is not.

SPEAKER_03 3:52

You've you've touched on one of the great mysteries of the universe. Um when the you know, when the medical when the order came down, it was sort of, you know, this bifurcation was a total surprise um to everybody, you know, particularly the people who were very close to the process. Nobody expected them to do this. Um and you know, I I suspect that what happened was, you know, if you if you you know closely read, and not saying that you didn't closely read it, but you know, one close read of the executive order or sorry, sorry, the final order, I should say, from the DEA and the DOJ was that was the Attorney General, is that um this has is that they really took a lot of pains to fit all of this into the mechanism required by the single convention, the UN Convention on Narcotics uh from the 60s, uh to set up the you know the medical benefits and this sort of whole process of selling to the DEA and then buying it back and the registration and all of that, all to fit it within that box um in order to play nicely with that. And um and that is arguably harder to do for adult use, which is probably what is going to get argued in the litigation, if you know adult use is also rescheduled. And so it was to try to bifurcate those two, you know. I think on its face, that's why

Why Medical Got A Different Track

SPEAKER_03 5:30

we we had that that split. Um because if they had done it all at once, uh it might have been harder to sort of fit it into that box. And you know, it also creates this this weird scenario. You know, we've got the, and I've written about this, is that um, you know, right now the way it's set up is that if you are, you know, if you register your medical state license, um and you enter into this buy and sell process, uh, you are arguing, you know, there's a very strong argument that you are no longer violating the Controlled Substances Act. You know, you still have this FDA problem, but you you're no longer violating the big the big rule, the big law. And so for state licensed medical, you know, DEA cannabis. And so, but you know, you know, let's say we also get this result, a positive result on um on adult use. Is the DEA going to set up this whole other process so that all of a sudden adult use cannabis is is legal? I mean, that that would be really weird. Um, I don't expect it. Um, I expect then you'll have this sort of like middle, you know, this place where it's on schedule three, but there's no DEA process. But then does that fit into this single convention? You know, again, that's what's going to be litigated. Um, but so I think it would make they have also been trying to set up sort of anticipating that, that they didn't want to fully like, you know, fully legalize, backdoor legalize adult use cannabis, like the way that they sort of have with medical. Um, it's all really weird. I mean, you know. But that's why I I was trying I was sort of being flippant in response to your your your question, but I'm dead serious. I mean, it is a total mystery as to why they did it.

SPEAKER_04 7:21

Yeah. Um, I some context. We had Natalie Furtak in the room uh uh on our behalf. She's writing more next week. She wrote a little bit for our newsletter. She was also on. Can I show you what she played just to get the color commentary from inside the well, she wasn't inside the room when she filmed this, let me be clear. Apparently, there's it's very strict. Like she described, you had to like get greeted at the door, they walked you in. You could have your phone, but you couldn't actually use it. And she has a laptop, so she's taking handwritten. No, she showed us in the but here's what she said about being in the room. Let me just rewind it. Hold on.

SPEAKER_00 7:52

Like going through it very methodically because they're trying to create, like both sides are trying to create a very specific argument. And so the anti-side is like very methodically going through every study and like asking an expert about these studies and asking him about his information. And so it's just it's it's a lot. It's like reading a bibliography out loud.

SPEAKER_04 8:14

I actually thought that was a great analogy, like reading a bibliography out loud, which is actually pretty similar to what Gary Kaminski said earlier in the week, and that the DEA was trying to make really one point. One point, really. That's what Gary Kaminsky said. She was talking about two points. But the first was that there is some version of meta, like there is one medically accepted use for this. And then the other point that DEA was trying to make that is nobody died from it. So, like those two things, but to me, that's great, but like I assume they've already litigated that in their head because medical cannabis is now schedule three. So, what is I guess, Mark, what does those arguments mean that there's a medically accepted use for cannabis, but we're actually talking about adult use cannabis and nobody's died from it. Like, I don't know how you it it seems to be like it's answering a question that nobody's really asking, but the DA and their the other anti-lawyers.

SPEAKER_03 9:07

Well, that that's the challenge here is that I mean, you know, the the DEA all all they really have to do is I from what I understand is is just sort of set it up for one. You know, they don't have to prove every medical use, they just have to sort of set up that there is a legit, you know, there is a reasonable basis for this. I don't think reasonable is the standard, but you know, there is a basis for this in order to get it on there. You know, I think though the one of the things that I anticipate uh will be challenged in court, you know, in the litigation, is that um is that you know, everything that's been established is for medical. And this whole process is about adult use. And so again, I think this is where um, you know, I I wouldn't, I I, you know, it isn't as much of a slam dunk as some are hoping it is.

AnnaRae Grabstein 9:58

Right. To push back on the only for adult use piece of that a little bit, it isn't just adult use, it's it's cannabis broadly. And so this would also filter through to the way that it's seen in in criminal uh situations as well, is my understanding. Maybe uh because it would know if someone was selling cannabis illegally um and they were being prosecuted for that or getting in trouble, they would be getting in trouble for a schedule three substance instead of a schedule one substance, right?

SPEAKER_03 10:31

Well, I I to be to I should clarify what I'm saying. This hearing is only taking testimony with respect to adult use cannabis. That's what you know. So the and the the the judge made it very clear at the beginning that none of you know the testimony is not about medical. Um, and so when the judge prepares their report, you know, and they're finding a fact to to issue to the DEA and the DOJ, it's only going to touch on the med, you know, that there is a medical benefit to, you know, to justify the rescheduling of adult use cannabis, which, you know, again, I think is one of the challenges, is that, you know, is that the DEA, you know, this is all said, you know, these are all benefits for medical, and they've already rescheduled medical. So how do you justify you know this as adult use? That's I I'm sort of sort of you know opening the baggage of what you know, I I I don't think saying anything that the the lawyers for the opponents haven't already thought of. So I don't know, you know, spilling any sort of like testing anything, and I'm not endorsing these arguments. Um, though some of my friends at the cannabis bar might kick my my ass.

SPEAKER_04 11:48

Well, well, this is interesting. This actually goes to mark what you said and Anna Ray, what you said, because what we've learned, which I don't think

Adult-Use Testimony And Litigation Setup

SPEAKER_04 11:55

I knew, but like the federal government can set what's on schedule one and schedule three and everything in between. And then many states default to that unless they take affirmative you know action to go against that or have to ratify that. But then we saw this this week, Wyoming said we're never we're not, this is going to be Schedule One in Wyoming no matter what, adult use cannabis. So, like, so you're talking about if you were selling cannabis illegally, you'd be skelet selling a schedule three drug if it was a federal crime, but depending on which state you're in, it could be a different level of crime, right? Like states, yeah, they they set their own some default to the federal government, but not all.

AnnaRae Grabstein 12:31

You scooped my loser, which is um which is the AG from Wyoming, Keith Kotz. Yeah. Um for his for his lame affirmation of schedule one, no matter what, uh, in Wyoming. Um I think super lame.

SPEAKER_03 12:47

Yeah. Yeah, it'll be I I I if I I I'm guessing that there is a you know that the the pre the law works that you can, you know, states can have more uh uh harder, tighter schedules, but not looser schedules is probably what the federal law says. Um right.

SPEAKER_04 13:05

One other point I just want to Well, well, actually to that point, Mark, to that point, um imagine things stay as they are, that there is medical cannabis is now schedule three, adult use cannabis is schedule one. I don't how we how you would interpret that in your own life is different, but like a state then has a state does have looser regulations than the federal government that has actually taken a stand against this. Like it's it's it's gonna get more complicated. I mean, I guess the question is by next Friday will we know something from this hearing? That's one question, and then what will it mean?

SPEAKER_03 13:39

Well, we won't know by Friday, you know, because it's gonna be a while before the judge issues their report. So we're just gonna, you know, I mean it who knows when that'll happen, but um, because I was wondering that same question.

SPEAKER_04 13:55

Well, didn't they say after the hearing closed? And also, aren't there brief, isn't there a brief, aren't there briefings afterwards? After the hearing, isn't that what I think that's yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_03 14:06

There is briefing afterwards to sort of set the positions. Um, yeah, no, it's gonna be, it'll probably be a you know, a number of weeks before we see anything, if not a couple months. Yeah, um, you know, the DA's probably not in much of a hurry. Uh, I could be wrong, but um, you know what, I mean one other point I want to just make is that well, two other points. One is is, you know, remember the states are the states are flouting the Controlled Substances Act already. So it's you know, it's not like much would change. Um, but yeah, I the other thing too is is I I I know I've this is sort of a slight tangent, but I know I've made this point in my cannabis musings before, but I want to reiterate again is that going back to this, you know, if unless you know, if we get adult use schedule three, um, but we don't get this buy-sell process and the DEA registration process, which again I wouldn't anticipate. Um, it could happen, but I wouldn't anticipate, it's gonna be a lot harder to convince the stock exchanges to allow for up listing for mixed for adult use cannabis and mixed use assets. Um because and so I, you know, I and I think all these investors and everybody's anticipating that that's gonna be the result. But the problem is that no law firm is gonna issue the legal opinion to bless that to the, you know, issue that legal opinion to the exchanges. So I don't, you know, I I'm very skeptical that there's gonna be this result that everybody's expecting if that happens. I could be wrong.

AnnaRae Grabstein 15:43

So I think that what you're pointing to is is about the potential challenges for investors if adult use gets rescheduled but not DE registered. I think though that there's a lot of other benefits that the industry is looking at. One that that I keep talking about is interstate commerce. And I think it's I think that that is that is the thing that people are looking at to be able to untangle some of the web of ideas and concepts that they're playing with that relate to medical. And what's interesting is if the DEA doesn't create that registration process for adult use, basically it is taxing medical providers and not adult use folks. So the adult use people wouldn't be getting to skip the VIG from the government. Um because the government is is taking fees through that DEA process. And otherwise they're gonna need to come up with some other way to get their piece.

SPEAKER_03 16:45

But that's true, that's true. Though I mean, but there you but the medical is then getting other benefits by being, you know, by getting it, because you you know, in that situation, you you still wouldn't necessarily have interstate commerce for adult use because the because the the the you would only have it for medical because the again the reason why the courts have struck down interstate commerce, um, or basically upheld the state blocks on interstate commerce is because it's legal and there isn't an and the and interstate commerce isn't uh the the dormant commerce clause and the benefits of the commerce clause don't apply to an illegal market. If um what but with medical, you know, you you no longer have that argument. If you know for DEA register medical, you no longer have that argument because it's not violating the CSA. Now you you may still have a problem with the Fed Food and Drug Cosmetics Act, but you know, putting that aside, but if if adult use is made Schedule three, but you don't have a DEA registration, you're still violating the Controlled Substances Act,

State Scheduling Conflicts And Enforcement Risk

SPEAKER_03 17:55

would be the argument. And so courts may not actually still bless adult use interstate commerce. So I it's yeah, I it is it's also fucking complicated. Um, but you know, so I I and I'm not trying to uh I'm just trying to clarify what you're saying there. Yeah um that it is uh you know is that but I agree with you that interstate commerce is one of the is one of the gold rings that we're all grasping for.

SPEAKER_04 18:26

Right, right.

SPEAKER_03 18:28

I totally agree with that.

SPEAKER_04 18:29

Um can we shift uh for a minute? Well, one we we will know uh we may know we may know something next week, it won't be more, and it's gonna be a number of weeks, months, maybe till we know anything. That's like the that's like the most can cannabis thing ever. It's a it's on a timeline, we just don't know it and can't predict it. And it may be major, maybe minor, may have no impact. Like, you know. Um, but there's other stuff happening in the same state because those hearings are happening in Virginia. Also in Virginia, there's now gonna be legalization starting a year from now, maybe a little bit less. We had on um earlier in the week Brett uh Brett Puffenbarger, who is not me, even though he does look like me. Um, and uh he had this to say about Virginia and how it's going. Then we can talk about this as an important state and what is coming in. But here's what he had to say.

SPEAKER_02 19:17

I think they are very leery at big kid ag coming in or large MSOs coming in. It's very clear that they want cannabis from Virginians, by Virginians, for Virginians. Growing up, they taught us well, you're a citizen of the Commonwealth before you're a citizen of the country. And I think that ethos is very clear in what they have done right today. And I'm hoping that ethos carries through till day one opening, right? Hence why we chose Old Dominion as our name.

SPEAKER_04 19:50

So it sounds like not that they're trying to create a cottage industry, they are trying to limit MSOs in particular in the state or the Commonwealth of Virginia. Um, and one thing he said before, and then we'll ask you both about it. Um he noted that uh most of the time when legalization bills get passed, governors and most elect officials don't actually have strong opinions about it. They actually have not given it enough thought. Apparently, that's not the case in Virginia. The governor had real indications of what she wanted to see, what she didn't want to see, which is why she vetoed the bill in the first place and why it is now folded into the budget and it's gonna happen. Um it's a pretty big state, pretty populous, um, heading south

Investors, Uplisting, And Interstate Commerce

SPEAKER_04 20:30

from DC. Like I think those are all interesting um indicators. Any sense of what's happening in Virginia, Anna Ray?

AnnaRae Grabstein 20:38

I think that there is a lot of excitement around Virginia. There has been people have been investing in it for the last couple of years, anticipating this moment. So I think it's it's going to be a great market. Um that's that's the high-level headline. Um I'm not sure that I believe that what Brett is talking about is going to manifest as reality. I think it's very challenging for states to effectively create strong walls around their borders in terms of who gets to participate in the market and keeping businesses out. Um, I understand that as a Virginian, that there are uh a lot of things about that that make it seem like there's a great possibility that he and his business will win a license. And I um I want the best for everyone. So I hope that everyone wins in that. Um, I don't think that Virginia is going to be able to close its borders any more than any other state has in terms of um making it so that licensees have to be residents of certain zip codes or things like that. All of those

Virginia Legalization And Market Design

AnnaRae Grabstein 21:50

uh type of restrictions have been overturned in other states uh by lawsuits. And I don't think that MSO. Are going to let it happen, especially ones that already are there. But I think that that Virginia is going to look a lot like Ohio in some ways. Like I do believe that they're going to take a strong regulatory hand in terms of product approvals, restrictions in terms of the amount of licenses that exist in the market. They've set a limit on the amount of dispensaries, things like that. So they are potentially setting up a situation where having a license is of tremendous value. And so how they're going to distribute those licenses is really what the question becomes. And when you have so many limits on the amount of licenses, those licenses automatically become more valuable. And that means that people fight for them a lot harder than when you're in a more open and unlimited license market like Oklahoma or even New York, there's a ton more licenses. And so they don't have the same value. Whereas an Ohio license trades for many millions of dollars more just for a straight cultivation license than it does in New York. And it's because there's only so many of them. And those restrictions are going to inherently create that inflated value. And I don't think capitalism is going to go away in Virginia campus.

SPEAKER_04 23:33

I think you're right. It also impacts, I mean, it also impacts the prices consumers pay when there's less of that competition and the value of the license goes up. I mean, that's it becomes an expensive place to buy weed, which is fine because Maryland's also an expensive place to buy weed, whereas DC is not. So it's it becomes an interesting market when the the jurisdictions actually touch each other. Um Mark, your thoughts on VA cannabis? We actually have a banner for it. Let me put it up there. There we go.

SPEAKER_03 24:03

Nice, nice. I love it. I know, I mean, Anna Ray, you know, it summarized it, you know, perfectly um and knows that that market better than I do, clearly. Um, I would just add um that uh, you know, to sort of touch on the point that Anna Ray made is that this is a uh, you know, this is one of those situations where you have the legacy of cannabis and the subculture of cannabis sort of uh running into the problem of how does it how does it grow into uh you know the US market, you know, legitim, you know, on a legitimate basis, uh, you know, and how does it uh you know, how does it interplay? You know, it it it's which is uh, you know, both fortunately and unfortunately demands, you know, that you know, has these demands from these large, you know, uh well well uh funded companies. And it's just the nature of of the beast. And um, you know, and the challenge also from the state's perspective, how do you find that balance where you you know you're not, you know, you're you're allowing other people to play, um, but you're also protecting your your citizens and making sure that that small owners don't get uh don't get crushed. And that's that's a hard thing.

SPEAKER_04 25:26

One of the call-outs that Brett was talking about uh is the timeline. Like they they sort of set a timeline to open, which is not them, but Virginia, July 2027. But applications are like due in February. It's unclear when they'll be given thumbs up. There's there'll be nothing on the shelves, I guess is my point, July 1st, even if there are dispensaries open, which we've we've actually seen in other markets that it takes a while for the the supply to catch up with the openings of the stores.

AnnaRae Grabstein 25:51

I I will just say that when when states are thinking about how to foster small business participation in in a new market, whether or not they're trying to specifically box out people from other states, I'll put that aside. But but but fostering participation from independent small businesses, equity operators, all of those things, really what we've seen across all of the states is the largest obstacle is capital. That is the difference between the big companies and the independent companies. And so if they want to foster participation, the way that they can do that is by injecting capital through, you know, state-level SBA style loans to small independent companies because they can do that. And that makes it so that those folks can actually compete and participate. But if if they're gonna give licenses to folks and those people don't have access to dollars, there's no way that they're gonna be able to compete with the large companies that are already there.

SPEAKER_04 26:52

They can do that, but there's a big difference between can and will in this scenario. I think.

AnnaRae Grabstein 26:58

I'm just saying that if they're actually serious about Virginia for Virginians, that is the way that they can do it. Yep is they can put money in the pockets of those businesses so that they can launch faster and um launch with actual uh dollars

Winners And Losers From The Week

AnnaRae Grabstein 27:15

to support their business.

SPEAKER_04 27:16

Agreed. It's now time on the show for our favorite segment. Are you ready? Already. Yes, already. Uh we're coming up on 27 minutes. Um, it is time for winners and losers. Anna Ray, I'm sorry I stepped on your loser. Are you okay with providing a winner and a loser, or do you want some more time?

AnnaRae Grabstein 27:42

Um well, so you did say my loser, the AG from Wyoming. Uh, I've got two winners. The first is um the citizen journalists and journalists that are showing up in Virginia. I'm just really grateful. And it's like cannabis news candy. So yeah, thank you to them um for making videos and putting out articles and talking about what it's like um in Arlington. And then um the other winner uh just because I like to see stuff new going on, is uh Glasshouse announced this week that they did their first hemp export from California to Europe from their um from their hemp uh greenhouse into a CBD program in Europe. And uh I just saw it as a bit of a first and also um an execution on a strategy that they that they celebrated loudly and that lots of us were skeptical about. So they they did the thing. They exported the hemp. So a busy month.

SPEAKER_03 28:40

Anyway, they you know, I know that they made some comments in the press release that this was couldn't have been done without rescheduling. Do you know why that was? I couldn't figure out what the connection was.

AnnaRae Grabstein 28:50

So no, I'm not really sure what the connection is either, but it maybe had to do with their DEA registration that helped them get a number for their export paperwork or something. Uh, but I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 29:02

Okay, yeah, I was curious. I was I was yeah, yeah. Um, I like that. Those are good ones. Uh Mark, winners, losers, what do you got? Um, a winner, this is a little cheating because I just posted about it in my musings earlier today, but I'm gonna shout out Camino, Kiva Camino, uh, the Conan O'Brien podcast. Conan O'Brien needs a friend. Um, yes, they they um uh they've been talking for a couple episodes about Conan uh you know trying to get him to take an edible. And Sona, um one of the co-hosts, uh talked about how she likes Camino a few episodes ago. And now, you know, Camino did the right thing and sent them a ridiculous amount of edibles, including some ones with uh with with Conan's face on it. You can check out the link online. Um you know, they they acted quickly, uh they had a good sense of humor about it, and you know, and Camino got a shout-out from a lot of press in you know, in a very popular podcast. So it's that kind of stuff that it only helps the industry.

SPEAKER_04 30:08

I I am with you on this, and I'm gonna go one level deeper because I first of all, it's my wife's favorite podcast. So she came home talking about Soma and her cannabis use, which she always does, but then the podcast itself, and then I re-watched it and they actually shout out someone very particular, and I think it's this person. Hold on. I think it's Melissa Henry. I don't know if you know Melissa Henry. Yes, anybody does. She can let me know. She is trade marketing director at Kiva. They said Melissa at Kiva sent the pack. And so If it's not this Melissa, it's another one. But this one is in LA, and they said they actually showed up in person. So shout out to Kiva and Conan O'Brien and Soma. But in particular, if you had said uh there's gonna be almost a half an hour conversation, maybe more, half-hour conversation about a cannabis brand based in California that's not a paid advertisement. This was worth more than most marketing campaigns all told. And Conan even said they are not paying for this. This is not something that they have done. Um, it was really the the and maybe Conan will start eating more gummies, which I think would probably serve him well. Um, but um, but it is it was really great, and it was a great shout out in your in the cannabis using, so get that in your inbox. But it was also an important podcast, an important moment. I don't think it's it's not rescheduling, it's not like earth shattering, but it is an important moment. I think uh being in the cultural zeitgeist with gummies is is good. I think. What are yours? Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 31:36

What do you got this week?

SPEAKER_04 31:37

Well, that was the one I act. That's why I slipped that future. Um, well, I will say there's uh there's a renewed effort here because it's so local in Ontario to crack down on unlicensed dispensaries. And they've had this, we've had this ongoing battle for a very long time since before legalization to now, the same stores are still open. Um uh and there's gonna be an effort to go after the landlords, which they've done in New York and some other places, and the penalties are actually quite high. So we'll see how that goes. At the same time, there's just been this ongoing investigation about police corruption. So that's the winner. There may be more enforcement. The loser is um there's been this ongoing police investigation of the police. So there's corrupt police um happening. And one of the things the corrupt police have been doing is taking bribes to not enforce crackdowns on these unlicensed dispensaries. So, like it's all mixed up in law enforcement and corruption. Um, so we will see what happens here. So winners and losers, both local here in Ontario, because it impacts me. Um but yeah, those are my winners and losers. And by next week, we won't know anything, but the hearing will be done. So we'll have some react from uh again, Natalie Fertig on our channels and other people too, so watching everybody who's reporting from there. Although apparently the courtroom is fairly small and sparse.

AnnaRae Grabstein 32:54

Yeah, not a lot of people are showing up. It's not convenient, it's not convenient.

SPEAKER_04 33:00

It's not convenient and not convenient, and and as Natalie said, she lives in DC. You know, getting to Pentagon City, she she likened it to I I forget what she liked, but it was like it's as the crow flies, it's not far. As people in DC, where a lot of the reporters live, it's like the Netherlands. Like it's never, they're never going there. She said she went there because she knew if she went there, she'd go to the mall across the street afterwards uh in Pentagon City. So um it was a fun interview. If you haven't seen it, you can check it out on our YouTube channel overall.

Webinar Plug And Closing Notes

SPEAKER_04 33:30

Um, one show note uh from ours, we have a webinar coming up on Thursday with our friends at Moby talking about investing in cannabis. If you are new to that, we have some CEOs uh from we have C-suite folks from Glasshouse, High Tide, uh Kronos, and Verano. So check that out. Uh, you can find that on our today's newsletter, but also on our website. Uh Mark, Anna Ray, anything else to announce to our robust audience? I'm good for today. Great. Well, find high spirits wherever you find your podcast. Uh go to Cannabis Musings. Uh Mark's got a great substack. Uh, thank you everybody for joining us here today. We'll be back next week with the full rundown of what's happening in cannabis. Uh, even though it's mid July, shit's happening. I like it. Sure is. Thanks. Thanks, everybody. Thanks a lot. Bye, y'all.